Uni graduates v. drama school graduates

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riverdancefan
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Re: Uni graduates v. drama school graduates

Post by riverdancefan »

Rose20 wrote:Hi, thought I would add my experience from a different area of study.
In the 80's my chosen career was considered to be a very practical subject involving a lot of hands on experience and training. When degrees were introduced none of us took it seriously and had the same views as many have about performing arts degrees now.
Fast forward 20 years and a degree is the only route into my job and people like me have taken them in our spare time to catch up!
I'm not suggesting this will happen in performing arts, just sharing my experience of how things can change. I won't go into whether this change is good or bad here, but there have been some benefits (in my opinion!)
That just HAS to be nursing Rose20 :D :D
"Tall and proud my mother taught me, this is how we dance" - RIVERDANCE
bop2thetop
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Re: Uni graduates v. drama school graduates

Post by bop2thetop »

Hi everyone

Just to update you, i contacted Chichester and they do do a Showcase for Agents now. Apparently it was introduced for the first time last year and about a third of the students gained Agents. They can also sign up to Spotlight. I just thought anbody interested might like to know. Also i am taking my DS down this Friday to audition. Is anyone else going ? :lol:
lbm1e14
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Re: Uni graduates v. drama school graduates

Post by lbm1e14 »

Thanks bop2thetop. That's a great development and begins to address the perceived difference between Uni and the drama schools. DD has a few girls from her year at school there. She wasn't close to hem so has had no contact since they started in Sept 2016. Best of luck.
paulears
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Re: Uni graduates v. drama school graduates

Post by paulears »

I just had to fire somebody, and I've replaced her with someone who is so much better. The one I now have has a degree from the local University, the one I lost studied at RADA. I really expected better from a RADA graduate - so I guess it's still down to the individual person, and while a prestigious name may well help you get the job, the weak ones will be exposed very quickly.
kzgirl
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Re: Uni graduates v. drama school graduates

Post by kzgirl »

I actually don't think it matters where you train as long as you have talent. Chichester has been mentioned a lot in this thread, Chichester offer around 5 to 6 courses in Musical theatre, the one nearest to a performing arts college appears to be the triple threat course. Talking to current third years there are showcases held in London for the agents etc. In the third year for the triple theat course there is also a tour production put on whereby the students audition to be considered. My DD has had experience of a performing arts college in London, in my opinion the downsides were, no teacher continuity, her teachers taught between jobs in the west end, she said some were amazing some weren't. Too many different opinions of how things should be done this confused the student as each teacher does things differently. In my daughters experience there were students at the college who could sing but hadn't danced so dancing was a challenge and became boring for the students who had been dancing since a toddler (especially tap). The colleges have agency's so if the student gains work they are taking their fees. I know this is the same after graduation. As a parent the college wasn't interested in my daughters welfare at all she was treated like she was still 11 years of age not like an adult and spoken to like a piece of sh**t by some of her teachers. This is a reputable college who have had graduates become pop stars. The buildings were tatty, there is air con in the dance rooms but the college didn't switch it on. Fees for these colleges are around £12-£15000 a year and the way the students are treated is sometimes appalling. If part funding is given this is being threatened to be taken away by the college if the student questions anything. As a parent I personally didn't think it was good value and had one very unhappy child. I know the industry is tough and students need to get used to the dog eat dog world but why pay to put your child through an unpleasant experience when training.
theMTAonline
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Re: Uni graduates v. drama school graduates

Post by theMTAonline »

I'm clearly biased running a drama college, however the differences are vast, and parents need to be aware of them. A good college (be it drama school or uni) will be offering AT LEAST 30 - 35 contact hrs a week. This is the absolute minimum that you should expect if your child is thinking of training to become a performer. The example of the college above is appalling - and indeed is a large part of what #time4change is attempting to address. FYI the full time colleges currently signed up to this are PPA, Mountview, Rose Bruford, Arts Ed and The MTA.
Things like dance classes should be streamed to ensure that everyone is progressing from their own starting point.
You need to know about Showcase opportunities, how many the college offer e.g. do they do productions throughout the year, or is it just a one off thing. A third of a year getting signed is not very good odds. You want a better percentage if you're paying for this course.
Some Casting Directors will only see people from established colleges, as they are assured about the standard of performer that they're going to be seeing. Increasingly their time is limited, so they can no longer afford to take a punt on a college that isn't established (regardless of how great the individual performer is).
You want a college that has 'live' industry contacts - because then, even if the college doesn't create enough opportunities, the students can create them for themselves.
Whilst the uni option can sometimes feel 'safer' for the parent - we are seeing a huge increase in the number of graduates having to retrain after uni courses - meaning that you're paying double. . . and for what? If it's the 'fall back' career, maybe think of it the other way around. Maybe your child could prepare for that when and if they need it. So a vocational course first - try it out, then in a few years time they can go back into college, secure some funding and retrain? That also means that they foot the bill, not you.
A degree will not get you a performing job - your talent will.
I hope that that helps to clear the air a bit?
kzgirl
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Re: Uni graduates v. drama school graduates

Post by kzgirl »

theMTAonline wrote:I'm clearly biased running a drama college, however the differences are vast, and parents need to be aware of them. A good college (be it drama school or uni) will be offering AT LEAST 30 - 35 contact hrs a week. This is the absolute minimum that you should expect if your child is thinking of training to become a performer. The example of the college above is appalling - and indeed is a large part of what #time4change is attempting to address. FYI the full time colleges currently signed up to this are PPA, Mountview, Rose Bruford, Arts Ed and The MTA.
Things like dance classes should be streamed to ensure that everyone is progressing from their own starting point.
You need to know about Showcase opportunities, how many the college offer e.g. do they do productions throughout the year, or is it just a one off thing. A third of a year getting signed is not very good odds. You want a better percentage if you're paying for this course.
Some Casting Directors will only see people from established colleges, as they are assured about the standard of performer that they're going to be seeing. Increasingly their time is limited, so they can no longer afford to take a punt on a college that isn't established (regardless of how great the individual performer is).
You want a college that has 'live' industry contacts - because then, even if the college doesn't create enough opportunities, the students can create them for themselves.
Whilst the uni option can sometimes feel 'safer' for the parent - we are seeing a huge increase in the number of graduates having to retrain after uni courses - meaning that you're paying double. . . and for what? If it's the 'fall back' career, maybe think of it the other way around. Maybe your child could prepare for that when and if they need it. So a vocational course first - try it out, then in a few years time they can go back into college, secure some funding and retrain? That also means that they foot the bill, not you.
A degree will not get you a performing job - your talent will.
I hope that that helps to clear the air a bit?
You are right if you have talent you will make it what ever route you go down.
Last edited by kzgirl on Sun Jan 15, 2017 9:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.
theMTAonline
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Re: Uni graduates v. drama school graduates

Post by theMTAonline »

Please don't misquote me - I said that a degree will not get you a performing job - your talent will. Training is imperative too (except in exceptional circumstances). This is about taking a punt on £27K which most people can't afford to do. If you're having to look for the same again (and a lot more in most cases) to actually be industry ready, then ensure that you're making that choice informed. . . not just hopeful.
I trust that clears up any confusion in my original post
bop2thetop
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Re: Uni graduates v. drama school graduates

Post by bop2thetop »

theMTAonline - I would love my son to audition for a well established well connected school. He deserves to go somewhere like that and I completely agree that he would have a better chance of getting work in the industry. But without student funding we just simply cannot afford it. Sigh :(
theMTAonline
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Re: Uni graduates v. drama school graduates

Post by theMTAonline »

Let him audition and then if he's successful start a dialogue with the college. I can't speak for the others, but we've always made it work. . . somehow. Nobody should be prevented a vocational training course purely for financial reasons. I think that you might be surprised at how flexible some of the colleges are. . .and a load of the larger colleges give boys full (or substantial) scholarships. Sadly we're not in a position to go that far . . . but we just get creative and make it work. That is our responsibility.
lbm1e14
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Re: Uni graduates v. drama school graduates

Post by lbm1e14 »

Hi bop2thetop. I would agree with themtaonline. You'd be surprised what can be put together to bridge funding gaps for a really talented candidate. Some colleges offer degree places in which case there are student loans available. You can get scholarships or bursaries. DaDa awards are also sometimes available if a student loan is not and the amount is based on household income and is not repayable, nor are bursaries which are usually awarded based on talent and potential. Where no DaDa or student loan is available then a Professional Career Development Loan can be an option. That is repayable but not until after the course is over. It's worth looking into all of these and maybe giving it a go. What I have mentioned above is only an attempt to say that Uni is not the only option if you can't afford to fund the course yourself. Each college website explains what funding is available. And not to forget that DD could get a job as well. Many performing arts students do and indeed should.

The main risk is disappointment if he gets a place and then you can't make it work financially. But given the industry he's chosen, disappointment will probably feature heavily every now and again!

It's worth a thought.
kzgirl
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Re: Uni graduates v. drama school graduates

Post by kzgirl »

bop2thetop wrote:Hi everyone

Just to update you, i contacted Chichester and they do do a Showcase for Agents now. Apparently it was introduced for the first time last year and about a third of the students gained Agents. They can also sign up to Spotlight. I just thought anbody interested might like to know. Also i am taking my DS down this Friday to audition. Is anyone else going ? :lol:
Hi bop2thetop

How did your son like Chichester, my DD went there at the beginning of December and has been offered the triple threat course. We have been looking at the catered halls there and it seems really nice. This is a good possibility for our DD. Has your son heard anything yet?
bop2thetop
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Re: Uni graduates v. drama school graduates

Post by bop2thetop »

kzgirl wrote:
bop2thetop wrote:Hi everyone

Just to update you, i contacted Chichester and they do do a Showcase for Agents now. Apparently it was introduced for the first time last year and about a third of the students gained Agents. They can also sign up to Spotlight. I just thought anbody interested might like to know. Also i am taking my DS down this Friday to audition. Is anyone else going ? :lol:
Hi bop2thetop

How did your son like Chichester, my DD went there at the beginning of December and has been offered the triple threat course. We have been looking at the catered halls there and it seems really nice. This is a good possibility for our DD. Has your son heard anything yet?

Hi kizgirl, Sorry about the late reply. Congrats to your DD. Yes he heard Friday that hes got on to the Triple Threat Course as well. Its his first audition so difficult to say if that will be where he goes but i think it would be a great place to go and i like the idea of the catered halls but i havent looked in to it properly yet.
kzgirl
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Re: Uni graduates v. drama school graduates

Post by kzgirl »

Well done to your son bop2thetop. DD had her audition at the Hammond yesterday. Really impressed with the college, this is her last audition so we just need to wait for the result now. She didn't get cut at lunchtime and she really enjoyed her day. There is a possibility that my daughter and your son may end up on the same course.
bop2thetop
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Re: Uni graduates v. drama school graduates

Post by bop2thetop »

Thank you kgirl. Sounds promising for your DD. fingers crossed. Thats good to know about The Hammond. Im very curious to know what its like there but DS hasnt had an audition come through as yet. I hope he gets one. Yes it does sound like they are applying to some of the same places. Where has your DD applied to? My son has applied to Chichester, The Hammond, GSA, LCM and Wolverhampton :)
Last edited by bop2thetop on Wed Feb 01, 2017 12:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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