Hi,
I really need some advice. DD is signed up with an agency and so far 2 auditions (since Sep 2012) and 2 self tapes, unfortunately didn't get any of those jobs. I signed up to starnow etc and if I saw any jobs I would submit (only done 3 as so few local) not thought anything of it but the past 6 weeks or so her starnow profile was viewed a number of times by one of the jobs we submitted for (an adoption video in cambridge details here -http://www.starnow.co.uk/listings/Listi ... _id=488307 )
The past few days DD agent has been complaining about people using sites such as KCCP etc saying they go to submit and see parent has already done it and they seemed very annoyed about it. They suggested parents remove children from those sites because they've signed up with an agent so why not let them do their job etc etc. So I figured okay fair enough they are right we've paid them to do this for us, deleted DD's profile on KCCP and was going to on starnow once her membership runs out, but sod's law I got a message from the adoption video people today asking if DD would do a self tape and asking if she has a permit (I stupidly figured because her agents details are listed on there they would contact agent if they wanted her).
I asked agent what I should do, should I ask them to contact agent or ignore it or what, they were very vague and said that if she took the job to let them know what dates she will be unavailable. So now I don't know what to do, ideally I'd like her to self tape in the hopes of getting the job but I'm nervous because how do I know it's a legit job and if it got that far how on earth do we go about getting a license etc?
This is stressing me out so much, feels like we can never win with DD's agent, always feels like we are doing something wrong and bothering them. Hubbie says we should just go for the job but I don't want DD to be penalised by her agent (they said something about kids not being submitted for jobs that day if they are submitting themselves) but I hate to think she might miss out on a good experience.
Any advice would be wonderful xx
Advice about starnow/agent problem
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eleanorrigby66
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Re: Advice about starnow/agent problem
I don't know how helpful this is, but I think you should be allowed to stay on StarNow and KCCP. A lot of adult actors will tell you that half their job is finding their own work - it can't just be down to the agent to do this. A lot of agencies will tell you this themselves (more for adults than for kids though, I've found). Why shouldn't you look for and find work yourself? The agent will still get their percentage, rightly or wrongly. It's ridiculous her expecting you to sit back and not put your DC forward for opportunities that the agent might have missed.
Re: Advice about starnow/agent problem
I say go for it too!
I have applied for my son on starnow and also a few weeks later his agent has put him through for similar jobs. Recently he auditioned for something that we had already sent a self tape for. I didn't have the courage to tell the agent so it was a second chance. Its all practice. Just enjoy it and do what you and your hubby want to do for your child. You know them best. Your agent has details of some jobs you don't see, being a parent. Most of starnow jobs are unpaid and experience. Stop worrying. If your child enjoys this type of "work" then encourage it as much as you want! Go get 'em
www.starnow.co.uk/adambeaver
I have applied for my son on starnow and also a few weeks later his agent has put him through for similar jobs. Recently he auditioned for something that we had already sent a self tape for. I didn't have the courage to tell the agent so it was a second chance. Its all practice. Just enjoy it and do what you and your hubby want to do for your child. You know them best. Your agent has details of some jobs you don't see, being a parent. Most of starnow jobs are unpaid and experience. Stop worrying. If your child enjoys this type of "work" then encourage it as much as you want! Go get 'em
www.starnow.co.uk/adambeaver
Re: Advice about starnow/agent problem
I'm interested in your relationship with your DC's agent.
The agent is there to get work for your child, so -assuming you also want jobs for your child - you should have a lot in common. This should be an easy partnership.
But the fact that you have posted here rather than picking up the phone to talk things through and gain a mutual understanding of what is best for your DC (not for the agent, not for you) suggests that your relationship isn't an easy partnership.
Am I right? If so, why is that?
I'm interested that michbv says 'I didn't have the courage to tell the agent...' Are we scared of agents? If so, why? What is the power dynamic here?
My advice is that, if you don't have a good relationship with the agent so that you can have an easy conversation about this, you either need to change the relationship or change the agent.
So, step 1 is to test this out and have a chat with the agent. As with any partnership or relationship, it's a good idea to think through what you want out of it first, and - in particular - what you want out of the conversation. It doesn't need to be confrontational. You could just ask for advice because you are confused about what you have heard so far and want to make sure that you're doing the best thing to make the partnership work for your DC.
From my experience, my DCs agents have always been happy for them to get work through other routes. They like to be kept informed of the jobs that are booked and will step in and pick up the arrangements if its appropriate - which is usually if it's financially viable for them to do so. I expect that they would get hacked off if they were putting DCs forward and felt that there was a risk that you might argue about their commission because you had also put them forward. Agents need to get paid - they do a lot if work 'at risk' and need a return on it someday. So your DCs agent may need reassurance on this point.
But if you don't feel sufficiently skilled to manage the audition process, or the licensing if your DC gets the job, then perhaps it's best that you don't initiate anything and leave it all with the agent?
Whatever you decide to do - and please let us know - make sure your relationship with DCs agent is a healthy one.
Good luck!
Deb x
The agent is there to get work for your child, so -assuming you also want jobs for your child - you should have a lot in common. This should be an easy partnership.
But the fact that you have posted here rather than picking up the phone to talk things through and gain a mutual understanding of what is best for your DC (not for the agent, not for you) suggests that your relationship isn't an easy partnership.
Am I right? If so, why is that?
I'm interested that michbv says 'I didn't have the courage to tell the agent...' Are we scared of agents? If so, why? What is the power dynamic here?
My advice is that, if you don't have a good relationship with the agent so that you can have an easy conversation about this, you either need to change the relationship or change the agent.
So, step 1 is to test this out and have a chat with the agent. As with any partnership or relationship, it's a good idea to think through what you want out of it first, and - in particular - what you want out of the conversation. It doesn't need to be confrontational. You could just ask for advice because you are confused about what you have heard so far and want to make sure that you're doing the best thing to make the partnership work for your DC.
From my experience, my DCs agents have always been happy for them to get work through other routes. They like to be kept informed of the jobs that are booked and will step in and pick up the arrangements if its appropriate - which is usually if it's financially viable for them to do so. I expect that they would get hacked off if they were putting DCs forward and felt that there was a risk that you might argue about their commission because you had also put them forward. Agents need to get paid - they do a lot if work 'at risk' and need a return on it someday. So your DCs agent may need reassurance on this point.
But if you don't feel sufficiently skilled to manage the audition process, or the licensing if your DC gets the job, then perhaps it's best that you don't initiate anything and leave it all with the agent?
Whatever you decide to do - and please let us know - make sure your relationship with DCs agent is a healthy one.
Good luck!
Deb x
Re: Advice about starnow/agent problem
Eleanor - I don't understand the problem with KCCP, starnow etc, I think the gist of it is that parents are applying for the bigger jobs on there(such as the recent KFC ad) and the agent is getting annoyed because they go to submit and get told they've already seen that child, maybe I don't know I just can't get my head around it fully.
Mich - That's what I was using starnow for to try and get her some experience whilst waiting for a job via her agent, better she does some local student films/unpaid work etc to add to her cv then just sit twiddling thumbs. That's why I have only applied for smaller jobs, this was the first bigger (and actually paid) job which I did because it's just down the road rather than London.
Flosmom - I don't know what our relationship is like at all other then fear. They seem to complain alot about parents doing things wrong so I'm always walking on eggshells afraid of saying the wrong thing to them. Example one woman wasn't sure whether to put her DC in spotlight as they have no experience so I simply told them spotlight advised me to wait until DD had experience even if school/drama club plays rather then having nothing at all on there. DD agent quickly stated that I was wrong and they submit with spotlight with/without experience and then a few days ago they advised someone that it's for 'very confident / commercial experience', I'd have to go back a few weeks but I'm sure when someone asked about being on KCCP they said sure it was another way of getting the kids out there and yet now they are seemingly very angry about people self submitting.
I emailed the agent before I did anything, told them about being contacted and asked them if I should point the client to them for further contact etc. I didn't get a yes or no answer just an "it's up to you if you want to stay on these sites but you need to tell us what dates she is booked out on" and then some more about how it makes their job harder when parents keep self submitting etc. I can't get my head around it, I mean it says £150 a day for that job so surely their cut of £150 is better then if she has no job at all i.e a cut of £0.
To be honest hubbie and I keep flitting between staying with current agent and changing, everytime they complain about parents doing X or parents doing Y it makes me panic and check and make sure I'm not one of the ones being talked about, particularly as I said they are not submitting kids who book direct. A little while back they again had a rant about people being with other agents (even though they are multi rep) and how they know when someone is picking a job with other agent instead of going through them and they are "making a note of it".
Thing is though we've already sunk a whole heap of money into her agent with "extras" for her profile and of course the initial signing fee and when I had some problems with DD stage school principal agent was great about it and gave some good advice. I just can't figure them out sometimes they seem lovely and really helpful and they do get alot of work in but then other times it's as if they are bitching about people which just seems wrong to me.
I've decided to leave it in the clients hands, I've been honest with them, said screen test is not a problem, already have permission from school to have time off etc but that her agent is the one who deals with license but if they don't want to go that route we can look into getting one.
Should be feeling really excited about her being considered for this job but her agent has made me feel like a criminal for submitting her and not letting them do their job.
Mich - That's what I was using starnow for to try and get her some experience whilst waiting for a job via her agent, better she does some local student films/unpaid work etc to add to her cv then just sit twiddling thumbs. That's why I have only applied for smaller jobs, this was the first bigger (and actually paid) job which I did because it's just down the road rather than London.
Flosmom - I don't know what our relationship is like at all other then fear. They seem to complain alot about parents doing things wrong so I'm always walking on eggshells afraid of saying the wrong thing to them. Example one woman wasn't sure whether to put her DC in spotlight as they have no experience so I simply told them spotlight advised me to wait until DD had experience even if school/drama club plays rather then having nothing at all on there. DD agent quickly stated that I was wrong and they submit with spotlight with/without experience and then a few days ago they advised someone that it's for 'very confident / commercial experience', I'd have to go back a few weeks but I'm sure when someone asked about being on KCCP they said sure it was another way of getting the kids out there and yet now they are seemingly very angry about people self submitting.
I emailed the agent before I did anything, told them about being contacted and asked them if I should point the client to them for further contact etc. I didn't get a yes or no answer just an "it's up to you if you want to stay on these sites but you need to tell us what dates she is booked out on" and then some more about how it makes their job harder when parents keep self submitting etc. I can't get my head around it, I mean it says £150 a day for that job so surely their cut of £150 is better then if she has no job at all i.e a cut of £0.
To be honest hubbie and I keep flitting between staying with current agent and changing, everytime they complain about parents doing X or parents doing Y it makes me panic and check and make sure I'm not one of the ones being talked about, particularly as I said they are not submitting kids who book direct. A little while back they again had a rant about people being with other agents (even though they are multi rep) and how they know when someone is picking a job with other agent instead of going through them and they are "making a note of it".
Thing is though we've already sunk a whole heap of money into her agent with "extras" for her profile and of course the initial signing fee and when I had some problems with DD stage school principal agent was great about it and gave some good advice. I just can't figure them out sometimes they seem lovely and really helpful and they do get alot of work in but then other times it's as if they are bitching about people which just seems wrong to me.
I've decided to leave it in the clients hands, I've been honest with them, said screen test is not a problem, already have permission from school to have time off etc but that her agent is the one who deals with license but if they don't want to go that route we can look into getting one.
Should be feeling really excited about her being considered for this job but her agent has made me feel like a criminal for submitting her and not letting them do their job.
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pleasingdance1
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Re: Advice about starnow/agent problem
You can submit your own license application to the council you don't need the agency to do it for you.Just ask the client to provide you with the part 1 to go with the parents section.
Re: Advice about starnow/agent problem
A large amount of kids with agencies have KCCP and starnow accounts and yours is the 1st agency iv'e seen to have a problem with it. I certainly wouldn't unsubscribe to them - as you say youv'e had 2 castings in 14 months so your agent is hardly keeping you busy. These sites are great for finding jobs when your'e going through a slow patch with the agency and also for building up a cv which will make your dd look more experienced to CD's. I don't think an agency can see who has submitted to jobs on starnow, probably can with KCCP?. Either way if you apply to a job thats gone to agency and they give you a casting, should you get the job then the company will book you through your agency anyway - that is money for nothing for them!!! Whats' to complain about!!!! As long as you are informing your agency of unavailability should she get the job, I don't see the problem.
Their tweets do come across often as quite aggressive and unproffessional, if they have a gripe about something that is happening a lot they should send a generic email out to parents explaining it. At the end of the day they are not a sole agency so therefore you can apply for whatever jobs you like.
Good luck to your dd, hope she gets it
Their tweets do come across often as quite aggressive and unproffessional, if they have a gripe about something that is happening a lot they should send a generic email out to parents explaining it. At the end of the day they are not a sole agency so therefore you can apply for whatever jobs you like.
Good luck to your dd, hope she gets it
Re: Advice about starnow/agent problem
Thank you pleasingdance, I had no idea if it was even possible, so fingers crossed if it gets that far and her agent doesn't want anything to do with it we can get it sorted ourselves x
Pooh - I've already deleted her KCCP profile, I was trying not to look on there anyway as I was tempted to sign up to submit to a few jobs but they seem so few and far between on there, wheras starnow seems alot more cost effective and seems to have more on(particularly local). I'm a little downhearted about the lack of auditions, it's the not knowing really are the CD not interested because we are an hour away from London, or do they not like how she looks, her lack of experience etc, I don't even know how many jobs she's being submitted for.
I am seriously considering applying to other agents, I just hate this constant feeling of being wrong and scared to say anything to them incase they take it out on DD. The person doing the video has viewed her profile again so fingers crossed it goes further, I hope so anyway, thanks for your message x
Pooh - I've already deleted her KCCP profile, I was trying not to look on there anyway as I was tempted to sign up to submit to a few jobs but they seem so few and far between on there, wheras starnow seems alot more cost effective and seems to have more on(particularly local). I'm a little downhearted about the lack of auditions, it's the not knowing really are the CD not interested because we are an hour away from London, or do they not like how she looks, her lack of experience etc, I don't even know how many jobs she's being submitted for.
I am seriously considering applying to other agents, I just hate this constant feeling of being wrong and scared to say anything to them incase they take it out on DD. The person doing the video has viewed her profile again so fingers crossed it goes further, I hope so anyway, thanks for your message x
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aspiringactressx
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Re: Advice about starnow/agent problem
I have a feeling I know which agency this is because I saw a conversation about this on a certain agencies twitter page yesterday saying similar things to what you're saying on here... if this is the same agency you're refering to, ironically, this happens to be my ex-agency!
Anyway, when I was with this particuar agency I was on lots of casting websites, and found myself tons of work and to be honest my agent was getting me so few castings and no jobs that it never conflicted with anything my agency wanted me to do. I started by going for very small student films with no pay and now I've got a good CV with a good amount of work. I usually only go for jobs now that are paid at least a small amount, or has a script that I really can't resist.
As an idea, I've had work for book trailers, short films and even a TV Show! Most of this was from Starnow.
I also have a different agent now who I have a much better relationship with.
I hope things work out for you with this agent, and I would say if you feel there is an opportunity you see on Starnow that's too good to miss - go for it!
Anyway, when I was with this particuar agency I was on lots of casting websites, and found myself tons of work and to be honest my agent was getting me so few castings and no jobs that it never conflicted with anything my agency wanted me to do. I started by going for very small student films with no pay and now I've got a good CV with a good amount of work. I usually only go for jobs now that are paid at least a small amount, or has a script that I really can't resist.
As an idea, I've had work for book trailers, short films and even a TV Show! Most of this was from Starnow.
I also have a different agent now who I have a much better relationship with.
I hope things work out for you with this agent, and I would say if you feel there is an opportunity you see on Starnow that's too good to miss - go for it!
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riverdancefan
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Re: Advice about starnow/agent problem
Don't feel you have to stop your Starnow membership
I know this agency, it's probably the only one with an issue where things like KCCP are concerned, and their messages and tweets have been incredibly unprofessional on occasion.
No way would they dictate to me... Bully boy tactics!
Have a look elsewhere....
I know this agency, it's probably the only one with an issue where things like KCCP are concerned, and their messages and tweets have been incredibly unprofessional on occasion.
No way would they dictate to me... Bully boy tactics!
Have a look elsewhere....
"Tall and proud my mother taught me, this is how we dance" - RIVERDANCE
Re: Advice about starnow/agent problem
Thank you both x
I've had a look around and most agents seem to be closed for applications at the moment so I think we'll just have to sit and wait and hopefully things will pan out okay with the agent if not I will be applying elsewhere when books open, just hope it's not out of the frying pan into the fire!
I've had a look around and most agents seem to be closed for applications at the moment so I think we'll just have to sit and wait and hopefully things will pan out okay with the agent if not I will be applying elsewhere when books open, just hope it's not out of the frying pan into the fire!
Re: Advice about starnow/agent problem
Hi Kazmama
I read your post, esp the bit about 2 castings in a year and expected your daughter to be about 15 so at the dead age. I followed your links and was amazed to see the most beautiful little girl and tbh at her age she should be mega mega busy with castings and jobs etc. so to be honest I would seriously think of changing agents as they are not working for your gorgeous little girl as they should be and I suspect because they have so many children. CDs will sometimes ask agents to only submit say 6 kids for a role so if there are 120 on your agents books that fit, the chances of even being submitted are pretty slim. Your little girl also looks that, little for her age, so when she hits 9 in a few months time (longer filming hours) she will be very valuable to production co's. So I would aim to have a new agent before she turns 9, its very easy to change agents on Spotlight so that wont be wasted money. I can understand agents getting a bit miffed when big jobs appear on KCCP etc but for smaller ones most agents would be pleased you are gathering show reel material. Hope this helps
I read your post, esp the bit about 2 castings in a year and expected your daughter to be about 15 so at the dead age. I followed your links and was amazed to see the most beautiful little girl and tbh at her age she should be mega mega busy with castings and jobs etc. so to be honest I would seriously think of changing agents as they are not working for your gorgeous little girl as they should be and I suspect because they have so many children. CDs will sometimes ask agents to only submit say 6 kids for a role so if there are 120 on your agents books that fit, the chances of even being submitted are pretty slim. Your little girl also looks that, little for her age, so when she hits 9 in a few months time (longer filming hours) she will be very valuable to production co's. So I would aim to have a new agent before she turns 9, its very easy to change agents on Spotlight so that wont be wasted money. I can understand agents getting a bit miffed when big jobs appear on KCCP etc but for smaller ones most agents would be pleased you are gathering show reel material. Hope this helps
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aspiringactressx
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Re: Advice about starnow/agent problem
I'm sure it will be better the second time around. Now you know what you're looking for and what to avoid you can search for an agent that will suit you better.
I know for a fact that this agency does get work - especially for the younger children - but they just have so many kids on their books that it is impossible for them to know EVERY child like they should do. I feel like that's why I missed out on a lot of work from them... they didn't really know what I was capable of and also put me forward for things that didn't really suit me. I have to say they have always been friendly and approachable to me, but I have heard of other people having trouble with them.
I also have to agree that their twitter page comes across as a little unprofessional, but they are a nice little agency at heart, they're not setting out to scam you, and they do find bits and pieces of work for some of their kids. Anyway, I'm sure you'll find an agent that suits you soon!
I know for a fact that this agency does get work - especially for the younger children - but they just have so many kids on their books that it is impossible for them to know EVERY child like they should do. I feel like that's why I missed out on a lot of work from them... they didn't really know what I was capable of and also put me forward for things that didn't really suit me. I have to say they have always been friendly and approachable to me, but I have heard of other people having trouble with them.
I also have to agree that their twitter page comes across as a little unprofessional, but they are a nice little agency at heart, they're not setting out to scam you, and they do find bits and pieces of work for some of their kids. Anyway, I'm sure you'll find an agent that suits you soon!
Re: Advice about starnow/agent problem
It sounds like you need to start looking for another agent. You aren't getting a return on your investment and it sounds like way too tricky a relationship to negotiate, in my opinion.
Top Talent are working towards this next round of workshops in February so you could contact Warren and see if they would invite your DD along. You probably won't hear until nearer the date, but you will have taken the first step.
Both my DDs started out with TT. They're not with them now, but this is what I know from their time with them:
TT don't look for experience. Their audition workshops are fun and they are on a roll at the moment with the work they are getting if their clients. They are a busy agency with quite a few kids on their books, but if you need to talk to them they are very accessible and friendly.
They don't charge fees for representation - just Spotlight and photos if you want them.
And they don't object to you getting work through other routes, as long as you keep them informed.
They get a lot of commercial castings so you have to be able and willing to turn up at short notice.
On the subject of licenses, the person in charge of the production should do that. You have to fill in a form and, if DC needs time off school, they'll usually ask you to get a form completed by the school too. You'll also need to provide a medical certificate, photo and copy of your DCs birth certificate. Then it's over to them. Unless you are a control freak like me, in which case you'll want to do it all yourself
Hope this is helpful - feel free to ignore me if it isn't.
Deb x
Top Talent are working towards this next round of workshops in February so you could contact Warren and see if they would invite your DD along. You probably won't hear until nearer the date, but you will have taken the first step.
Both my DDs started out with TT. They're not with them now, but this is what I know from their time with them:
TT don't look for experience. Their audition workshops are fun and they are on a roll at the moment with the work they are getting if their clients. They are a busy agency with quite a few kids on their books, but if you need to talk to them they are very accessible and friendly.
They don't charge fees for representation - just Spotlight and photos if you want them.
And they don't object to you getting work through other routes, as long as you keep them informed.
They get a lot of commercial castings so you have to be able and willing to turn up at short notice.
On the subject of licenses, the person in charge of the production should do that. You have to fill in a form and, if DC needs time off school, they'll usually ask you to get a form completed by the school too. You'll also need to provide a medical certificate, photo and copy of your DCs birth certificate. Then it's over to them. Unless you are a control freak like me, in which case you'll want to do it all yourself
Hope this is helpful - feel free to ignore me if it isn't.
Deb x
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Dwafffamily
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Re: Advice about starnow/agent problem
I agree with the above about looking for a new agent, but I can't agree with just listing one known reputable agent, I'd say it's far more helpful to Atleast name a few. I suggest you look at a number of other agencies in order to get a feel of which may be best for you.
top talent, Bruce and brown, AJ management, CS, Sylvia Young, Abacus, Daisy Dukes, Bonnie and Betty and several more. Research, ask questions and then research some more
top talent, Bruce and brown, AJ management, CS, Sylvia Young, Abacus, Daisy Dukes, Bonnie and Betty and several more. Research, ask questions and then research some more